Comedy, Offensiveness, oh my.

We pick on Glee a lot for being offensive, and I’m getting a little worried that we’re gonna look like a couple of assholes who are just calling out TV shows for the slightest infraction. This is not at all the case, and I’m going to try and explain our views on “offensive” comedy. We really, really don’t care how offensive a TV show (or anything else) gets. I’ve watched a number of episodes of Two Broke Girls, and it’s terrible. It’s a horrible show, but it’s not really trying to be anything else. It makes racial jokes because that’s all it has. It’s a sad state of affairs, but we’re not offended.

What we care about is when a TV show (such as Glee) sets itself up to be a movement against homophobia, racism, and Mean People, and then goes and makes the entire show based on shallow stereotyped jokes. Our problem is the hypocrisy, not the content.

Here is our firm opinion on comedy:

There are no taboos.

We 100% believe that. There is no subject that is too far, and there is no subject that is off limits. There are only people who approach topics poorly, and people who don’t understand what the actual joke is about.

We’ll give you an example.

In his special “Hilarious”, Louis CK does an excellent joke about fucking a dead kid in a field. That sounds terrible, and us calling the joke “excellent” make us sound like terrible people. But it sounds terrible because we sucked all the funny out of the joke by just stating the premise in a comedic vacuum—and that’s what happens when someone is offended. They state a joke as fact, suck all the funny out of it, and then they make it offensive. It wasn’t offensive when Louis CK said it, it was offensive when some asshole recounted it, because he was an unfunny piece of shit. Watch the original special, and if you’re offended by what Louis actually said, that’s fine. We don’t have to be friends.

The worst thing that someone can do to comedy is to take a joke out of context. Great comics are wholly open and honest on stage, bits come up that aren’t planned, and they aren’t trying to censor themselves. So, when you’re some idiot who went to a Tracy Morgan show and got offended, you got offended because you’re an idiot. In the hundreds of articles that came out of that whole clusterfuck, Tracy Morgan was quoted as “wanting to stab gay kids”. This is 100% true if you don’t have a funny bone in your body. What actually happened was that he was in the midst of a bit about how he thinks that gay people shouldn’t talk with a lisp. And if he son were gay, he’d better come and tell him “like a man”, and not with a lisp, or he would “stab that little nigga”.

This certainly isn’t an open minded joke, and it’s probably not even a good joke, but it certainly doesn’t mean that Tracy Morgan wants to stab gay people. It means that Tracy Morgan says crazy shit on stage, and not all of it is going to be palatable to everyone. The fact that he made that joke does not mean that he’s homophobic, or that he’s prejudiced, or any of the myriad of things that he was accused of. He very well may be homophobic or prejudiced, but not because of that joke. Also, THERE WAS NO VIDEO OF THE JOKE. The entire proof of his homophobia came in the form of a Facebook note posted by someone who was at the show. A fucking Facebook note.

In the weeks after the whole Tracy Morgan thing, bloggers clearly got the message that taking comics out of context was going to give them mad page views. So then Jo Koy did a show in Chicago, used the word “faggot”, and then another shitstorm started. I actually know the guy who opened the show, and he wrote a very interesting blog post about the whole thing, which you can read here. Scroll down to Wednesday (and especially the end of the post) for his account of the whole stupid incident.

Here’s what really bugs me the most: that Glee is so willing to make certain topics taboo, while also protecting their own shitty jokes under the umbrella of comedic license. They are setting fire to this umbrella that we love so much, and we we’re just trying to kick them the fuck out from under it.

Great comedy is raw, uncensored and honest. If it ever becomes hesitant or guarded, then it has lost everything that makes it great. In trying to guard comedy, you are killing art. Stop killing art.

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  • Anonymous

    The Tracy Morgan shitstorm was particularly bothersome to me for just the reason you said. His quote was actually about stabbing the kid for “not being a man” but the media reported it as stabbing the kid for being gay. Essentially, they’re trying to condemn homophobia and at the exact same time they’re perpetuating a stereotype, that gay men are not masculine, by acting like being gay and “not being a man” are the same thing.

    I personally think that it would be a big help if celebrities who found themselves in these shitstorms took a stand for what they said and refused to apologize, and instead encouraged people to do a little research and figure out the context in which something was said. Besides, I’ve always thought that demanding an apology was one of the most useless things you could do, because there’s no way it’s gonna be sincere at that point. 

    • Jack

      Frankie Boyle Furinto… Frankie Boyle

      • Lee

        I think any time you use the phrase “being a man” you are pretty much announcing to the world that you are a patriarchal asshole. Homophobia and sexism exist purely because of the social construct of “maculinity”. 

        People are entitled to find whatever they like offensive. You find pithy, low substance kids shows about singing and dancing offensive because you believe they mar your perfect ideas about art and humor. People find jokes about homosexuals getting their throat slit for the capital sin of not “being man enough” offensive because a whole group of people has been oppressed and threatened for being who they are. Different strokes.

        • Tim

          For me, the fun of comedy is my thoughts on the joke in context. If I hear a phrase or word that is on my list of bad words and I just shut down and cry offensive, that is of no value to me because I am not thinking about it. This post calls for comedians and writers to be honest about what they are and for viewers to have discernment. I’m not sure why that message is so troubling.

        • Vince

          You can’t fault people for using words and phrases that, out of context, seem to degrade others. This is why I find political correctness so ridiculous. People grew up with certain dialects and accents, and words and phrases.

          An example, when people refer to African Americans as “black people”. Also, when others call something that they thought was fruity, “gay”. I got a lot shit from these when I was studying in Cali. I grew up around these phrases, just cause I say them doesn’t mean I think African Americans and/or homosexuals are different from me.

        • Anonymous

          Glee isn’t pithy.

        • Rich

          Yeah, you’re right, disliking someone for their personality is so horrible and wrong and it MUST be stereotypically connected to their race, or sexual orientation because God knows that’s the only reason anyone ever dislikes someone that isn’t exactly like them. 

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1475130094 Heather Lynn

    Jokes are offensive, to me at least, when they’re made to support the status quo and without awareness of real oppression and harm done in the world. These jokes? They’re not funny. If the punchline is ‘because they’re [black, woman, disabled, ect.]!’ then the comedian is usually not trying very hard and relying on a shitty stereotype to tell a shitty joke. You already mentioned Louis CK, who is an example of how to use any subject to be funny. Sarah Silverman is also foul, but she’s awesome and challenges stereotypes in her routines. 

    • Groovypants

      “Jokes are offensive, to me at least, when they’re made to support the status quo and without awareness of real oppression and harm done in the world.”

      That’s why I feel that the full context for Tracy Morgan’s remarks doesn’t actually make them less offensive. We do live in a society where gay men face the threat of violence, even from their parents, for acting in an “effeminate” manner, and reducing that to a “gay people talk funny” joke is not ok. Yes, the context of a joke is important, but so is the social context in which that joke is made.

    • Anonymous

      Well said; you’ve basically expressed all my feelings which I didn’t know how to put into words lol 

  • Ericwhe

    I’m going to have start a website called LouisCKsucks.com.

  • http://twitter.com/G1CALEBLL Caleb Lee Lambright

    Cake Aproves of This Entry
    but Wants to MURDER CHRIS AND TIM
    THE FAGGOTS!

    just kidding.

  • http://twitter.com/G1CALEBLL Caleb Lee Lambright

    but yeah………no seriously
    i Love you guys thanks for making my day

  • MimsPeas

    I’m a ‘mo and I didn’t find Tracy Morgan’s comment at all offensive, nor did I find it funny. I live in a pretty dark world so I find the “offensive” jokes very amusing. When it comes to speech, vocal inflections, et al, I think I’d be more bothered if my child spoke with a black-cent (that’s the abbreviation for “black accent,” i.e. ebonics) than if he spoke with a lisp.

  • Anonymous

    One of my favorite quotes about humor comes from Aristotle, who considered humor the measure of gravity, and gravity the measure humor. A subject that is considered “too sacred” to joke about isn’t worth much consideration, and a joke that doesn’t bear serious examination is false wit.

    This generally summarizes why I think Glee fails as a vehicle for social commentary, as well as comedy.

    • Nena

      Very, very true.

  • Anonymous

    Almost all comedy is is offensive, that is unskillfully done. I still get booed even for badly told aren’t you glad i didn’t say “banana” jokes knock knock jokes.

    For a comic, I think failing to engender a chuckle is the most offensive thing of all.

    Yes, by that standard glee offends me until it is filtered properly through this site(then not so much).

  • Stevens

    A joke is 50% shock 50% context. An awful joke can be hilarious given the context (puffy shirt from Seinfield, that whole premise is awful on its own, give it the context of the episode and it is masterful). Tell someone a knock knock joke that is bad. If you just tell it as a joke, it isn’t funny. But tell it in a goofy. “god this is awful but listen anyway” and it is funny!

    On the article itself, brilliantly well written. This is pure, unabashed honesty on comedy. This is the reason I watch Arrested development over how I met your mother, or Monty Python reruns over Big bang theory, Shock value brings incredible humour, context can turn shit into gold, mix them together (the dead parrot sketch is perfect for this), and you have a joke that rips everyone’s funny bone apart.

  • Anonymous

    I think what offends me about 2 Broke Girls is that I see its capacity and think that it COULD be a good show but its depiction of POCs really drags it down. They do some types of jokes well and I like that it’s a show centered around women who are allowed to be funny. The writers know how to write white women, but they don’t know how to write anything else. If all the jokes were @ “two and a half men” level, then I wouldn’t be offended because I’d be like “oh, well, they just suck at everything”.

    I’m not crazy about shock humor (I know it’s supposed to challenge our assumptions but I don’t think it’s as thought-provoking as people claim it to be) but I do see your point. Absolutely, Glee is hypocritical and that’s exactly why people hate on it so much. And Louis CK is flawless, ofc. 

  • Anonymous

    I love inappropriate humor. My favourite comedy TV show of all times is little known BBC comedy Beautiful People. It’s main character is a 13 years old gay boy, who lives with his absolutely crazy family. It makes fun of basically everything you can think of, it is offensive and it is funny. It’s not kind humor, but even though they are so over the top, you can still see the characters as real people, which is something that both Glee and 2 Broke Girls fail at.

    My biggest problem with Glee and it’s humor is that it’s totally hypocritical. When Sebastian (the villain character) says something offensive, we are supposed to consider it bullying. When Santana or Kurt (who are the bichiest characters on Glee) say the same thing, we are supposed to consider it super funny and the best joke in the episode. Why is it so different?

  • Aspeer1

    OK, ‘Fucking a kid in a Field’ is not funny in any context. I lost my respect for this site!!!!

    • JCtheMentalist

      Wait, I don’t understand. Can you elaborate?

      • Aspeer1

         According to this post when people ‘suck the fun out of a joke, they make it offensive’. the fact that a ‘fucked dead kid in a field is fun to joke about is offensive in itself. It seems hypocrtitical to say that the audience is making it offensive, when the comedian is the one telling it for the purpose of laughs, and the defenders of CK Lewis, (aka. the the poster of this article) are equally guilty. Sorry Chris, claiming your guilt for admitting the joke as ‘excellent’ does not redeem you in my book.

        • http://gleesucks.com Chris

           Did you watch the joke? That’s not actually what the joke is about. My point is that a detractor would describe the joke that way, and then other people would be offended, which is exactly what happened here.

          I described the joke that way because it’s the most offensive way to describe it, and you just took my word for it, instead of actually watching the bit. You are the problem.

          • Aspeer1

            Ahhh, OK!  point well taken. I understand your stance and it is clear that I quickly jumped to conclusions. I apologize. And I still like this site and will still continue to visit. Glee is probably the worst  ”comedy”/musicals ever written, and the site is doing a lot of people a favor by helping them realize this fact.

    • http://gleesucks.com Chris

       I’m confused as to how you respected us at all. We are a site that talks shit about a television show.

      • Tim

        Who knew people respected us? If we had known that there was all this reverence for us, we would have never risked calling for honesty and saying that audiences should think about things in context before they judge them. We should have stuck to the high level art of making jokes about one bad show. That way we would be above reproach.

  • http://people.ign.com/supasmashbrotha SupaSmashBrotha

    I’m inclined to agree. One of the reasons Arrested Development was hard to approach was b/c of how crass some of the humor was (incest, infidelity, racism).

    Although I think you guys do reach a little bit when you act like Glee writers can’t wait to leave the office to burn crosses.

    • http://thefutureamerican.wordpress.com/ Jaycee

      What? Nobody ever said that. We think they’re too dumb to recognize when they’re being racist.

  • Me

    Just something I noticed…but you guys put an awful lot of attention to something u don’t like….everyone has their opinion though. I’m just wondering what’s in it for you.

    • http://gleesucks.com Chris

      Luckily for you, we have a Mission Statement and F.A.Q. that answers these questions. You can find it here: http://gleesucks.com/about/

      I understand if that button at the top of the page was too hard to find.

    • Rich

      …You went and googled “Glee Sucks”, clicked on the first link, cycled through the home page, and then either began reading reviews or just came right here having noticed the criticism of the show and *now* you”re just noticing they don’t even like Glee?

  • Addams

    I love dark humour, offensive jokes are usually only funny if they’re pointing out how stupid it is that people find that thing offensive. Glee seems like it tries to do that but fails. Epically. I hate Glee because it’s original sale point was that it disproved stereotypes, but then it enforced them! Its like it was trying to show what kids were like behind the stereotype but then decided it would be funnier to enforce them. Like dumb blondes (Britanny), asian kids and electronics (Asian camp), bitchy latinos (Santana), flamboyant gays (Kurt), slutty cheerleaders and so many more!